Post by Raeph on May 6, 2015 12:58:03 GMT
As your skills grow and you start to fly bigger ships, you might notice that even though your DPS in the fitting window or pyfa is going up, your damage might not be going up as quickly against small ships. You might be finding that you're doing much more damage to ships your own size than smaller ones when you're running missions. You might even notice that against ships the same size, sometimes you do a lot more damage to some ships, while others you'll barely hit. Even the same ship, sometimes you might hit for a lot, sometimes you might do almost no damage!
Here's why!
It's to do with the signature size and angular velocity for guns or speed for missiles of the ship you're firing at.
In EVE, the actual size of the ship doesn't matter, it's the signature size that's important. They are related, but just because two ships are the same size, it doesn't mean they have the same signature size. Even two identical ships can have different sig sizes depending on fit and what modules are active. Obviously speed varies depending on ship, skills and fit.
Think of it this way, if you're holding a gun, shooting a huge, slow moving object is pretty easy. Shooting a small, fast moving object is harder. If you're firing a gun that shoots in a straight line, a fast moving object that's coming directly at you will be easier to hit than one that's moving from one side to another at the same speed too!
If you're using guns:
All guns have a stat called tracking. You'll find certain ammunition and certain guns will track better than others. The short range variants (blasters, pulses and autocannons) will have better tracking than their long range counterparts for example. Ammunition like multifrequency for lasers will also have better tracking. Those of you that can use T2 pulse lasers for example might find that against frigates, you'll kill a ship faster with multifrequency than with conflagration, just because the tracking is better.
Unless a ship is flying directly towards or away from you, it will have angular velocity or transversal velocity. There's a LOT of confusion in EVE over which is more useful since they both are relevant to the speed that a ship is flying across you. The important one (and the one you want displayed on your overview if you're into combat) is angular velocity. The short reason for this is that it's the stat that your guns show when you look at the tracking stat, so it's much easier to reference to see how well you're going to hit. The longer answer is that transversal velocity is the speed that someone is flying across you. Just knowing that someone is flying a certain speed across your screen doesn't help all that much as someone that's flying 1km/s and is only 1km away from you will have a LOT of angular velocity and guns might find it hard to keep up. Someone flying the same speed but that's 100km away from you will have a very small angular velocity and if your guns can hit that far, they should have no problem tracking.
It's useful to have a rough idea of how much tracking your guns have. You can see by right clicking on your guns (either in the fitting window or when undocked) and then looking in the attributes. It'll also show you in PYFA or EFT. This will allow you to pick your targets much better as you'll want to find the ones that have less angular velocity. Bigger guns have worse tracking, making it harder to hit small ships that have angular velocity.
If you're using missiles:
Firstly, angular velocity makes no difference to missiles. Whether a ship's flying across, towards or away from you makes no difference at all. The speed is important though.
Explosion radius and velocity are the two key things here in working out damage. It's a bit confusing, so I'll try and use a visual explanation.
Imagine than when a missile explodes, the damage is done in a sphere around where the missile was when it exploded. The damage is shared equally around the sphere. That sphere is the explosion radius. If the signature size of the ship you're firing at is the same size or bigger than the explosion radius, the whole sphere is "inside" that ship, meaning that all the damage that's shared across the sphere is applied. Your missile will hit for 100% damage if the target isn't moving! If however the signature size of the ship you're firing at is only 1/4 of the explosion radius, your missile will only hit for 25% damage because the 75% of damage that's shared out over the rest of the explosion radius that's "outside" the target is missing.
So when the ship's not moving, it's pretty straight forwards to work out how much damage you should be doing.
When the ship's moving, it gets a little more complicated. You have to work in explosion velocity too. For this, you have to imagine the sphere is growing at the rate of explosion velocity. When the missile explodes, it does so right on top of the ship you're firing at. Now if the sphere grows too slowly, the ship will be out of it before it manages to do full damage! This is worked out in a similar way as the explosion radius calculation apart from the ship speed wants to be slower than the explosion velocity for more damage. If the ship you're firing at is going the same speed as the explosion velocity and it's sig is the same size or bigger than the explosion radius, you'll hit for 100% damage! If however it's going at twice the speed, then you'll only hit for half damage.
The bigger the missiles you're firing, the bigger the explosion radius and the slower the explosion velocity. That means that smaller ships will have a smaller signature and be travelling faster, which means less of your potential damage is applied.
These two stats stack, so if you're firing a missile that has a 1km explosion radius and the velocity is 10km/s, if the ship that you're firing at has a sig size of 500m and is travelling at 20km/s, you'll only hit it for 25% damage as you lose half damage from the sig size, then half of that total from the speed.
So what can I do to improve my damage against smaller targets?
For guns:
- Shoot things that are further away (but still within your optimal or a good way into your falloff). Things that are further away will have less angular velocity than things closer that are moving the same speed.
- Shoot things that are flying towards or away from you instead of from side to side. Unlike missiles, guns will hit things that are flying directly at you at high speeds.
- Train motion prediction. This is one of those awkward skills that people often skip because it doesn't give any awesome damage numbers. When you think of it in terms of "5% extra tracking can be up to 5% extra damage on ships with high angular" though, it starts to look a lot more appealing.
- Fit tracking computers/enhancers. Computers are better, especially because they can be scripted, but both of these modules give you better tracking for your guns.
- Metastasis rigs will help your guns track better.
- Think about what ammunition you're using. Some give bonuses to tracking, some actually make tracking worse!
- If you're in a small ship with a short range, webs can help you slow ships' angular velocity and help you hit better. If you're in a long range ship, they'll still help but you might just want to throw out drones as unless you have a few webs, tracking can still be quite poor on small ships.
For missiles:
- Shoot things that are moving slower. For pure missile players, angular velocity doesn't matter at all, it's all about the speed.
- Train guided missile precision. Yep, it requires missile launcher operation 5 but it's worth it. It decreases the explosion radius by 5% per level. That means that against smaller ships you can do up to 25% extra damage!
- Train target navigation prediction. This is worded very weirdly, but it's easiest to think of it as it increases the missile explosion velocity by 5% per level (that's not quite how it works technically, but the effect is the same) so it helps to hit fast moving ships.
- Warhead rigor catalysts will help with the signature size of ships.
- Warhead flare catalysts will help with the speed of the target.
- Keep an eye on ship speed. If something suddenly goes from flying 700m/s to 3000m/s, it might be a good idea to shoot it! Yep, it's flying over 3x as fast, but it's probably just activated a MWD which makes it's sig size 5x bigger.
- If you can use T2 ammo, some missiles are better at hitting smaller targets than others.
So that's all great for shooting stuff, but what can you do to reduce the amount of damage you've got incoming?
I'm gonna skip resists here, more resists = less incoming damage, pretty simple.
You basically have to think about the opposite of what the above says. So slow ships with big sigs that are travelling directly at enemies will take a lot of damage.
There's actually very few ways of reducing your sig from the starting point. There are some implants and the prospect gets a bonus for advanced mining frigates to sig size, but in general there's no way to reduce it. What you can do though is be careful about how much you increase it. Certain modules, especially shield modules, will increase your sig size, potentially by quite a lot. Most shield rigs will increase your sig size, shield extenders too. Of course these modules can significantly increase your survivability so you have to weigh up the pros and cons of them. Be wary of modules like inertia stabilisers, they significantly increase your signature size with no bonuses to your tank, especially if you're trying to fit a travel ceptor or something similar, these are more likely to get you killed than save you. Also beware MWDs, usually you want to get into range with them, then turn them off. As I said in the improving missiles section, MWDs massively increase your signature size (by 5x). Once you're in range, you should turn them off again.
Speed is pretty simple, there's lots of mods and rigs that will increase speed. Be careful though as a lot of them will also reduce armour (maybe not an issue if you're shield tanking) or structure. If you're going for a PvE fit, if you have the capacitor to fit an afterburner, that can be a good idea as although it doesn't give you as much speed as a MWD, it also doesn't have the drawbacks.
Angular velocity is something you can practice and do while you're flying around. Remember it doesn't matter against missile ships, but if you're fighting something with guns, always keep an eye on which way you're facing. One thing you can do is try and set up your camera so whatever you have selected is right in the middle of your screen, then double click halfway between the centre and edge of the screen, when done right, that will let you spiral in towards your target so you're always closing range without losing angular velocity until you get close enough to get into an orbit. If you're fighting two ships, be aware of your orbit. If from the point of view of the other ship, you're orbiting from left to right, that means there's times when you're flying directly towards or away from him. Try and get into an orbit that the other ship would see as a circle to maintain angular.
For more detailed articles on weapons mechanics, take a look at these pages:
Turret damage: wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Turret_damage
Missile damage: wiki.eveuniversity.org/Missile_Damage
Here's why!
It's to do with the signature size and angular velocity for guns or speed for missiles of the ship you're firing at.
In EVE, the actual size of the ship doesn't matter, it's the signature size that's important. They are related, but just because two ships are the same size, it doesn't mean they have the same signature size. Even two identical ships can have different sig sizes depending on fit and what modules are active. Obviously speed varies depending on ship, skills and fit.
Think of it this way, if you're holding a gun, shooting a huge, slow moving object is pretty easy. Shooting a small, fast moving object is harder. If you're firing a gun that shoots in a straight line, a fast moving object that's coming directly at you will be easier to hit than one that's moving from one side to another at the same speed too!
If you're using guns:
All guns have a stat called tracking. You'll find certain ammunition and certain guns will track better than others. The short range variants (blasters, pulses and autocannons) will have better tracking than their long range counterparts for example. Ammunition like multifrequency for lasers will also have better tracking. Those of you that can use T2 pulse lasers for example might find that against frigates, you'll kill a ship faster with multifrequency than with conflagration, just because the tracking is better.
Unless a ship is flying directly towards or away from you, it will have angular velocity or transversal velocity. There's a LOT of confusion in EVE over which is more useful since they both are relevant to the speed that a ship is flying across you. The important one (and the one you want displayed on your overview if you're into combat) is angular velocity. The short reason for this is that it's the stat that your guns show when you look at the tracking stat, so it's much easier to reference to see how well you're going to hit. The longer answer is that transversal velocity is the speed that someone is flying across you. Just knowing that someone is flying a certain speed across your screen doesn't help all that much as someone that's flying 1km/s and is only 1km away from you will have a LOT of angular velocity and guns might find it hard to keep up. Someone flying the same speed but that's 100km away from you will have a very small angular velocity and if your guns can hit that far, they should have no problem tracking.
It's useful to have a rough idea of how much tracking your guns have. You can see by right clicking on your guns (either in the fitting window or when undocked) and then looking in the attributes. It'll also show you in PYFA or EFT. This will allow you to pick your targets much better as you'll want to find the ones that have less angular velocity. Bigger guns have worse tracking, making it harder to hit small ships that have angular velocity.
If you're using missiles:
Firstly, angular velocity makes no difference to missiles. Whether a ship's flying across, towards or away from you makes no difference at all. The speed is important though.
Explosion radius and velocity are the two key things here in working out damage. It's a bit confusing, so I'll try and use a visual explanation.
Imagine than when a missile explodes, the damage is done in a sphere around where the missile was when it exploded. The damage is shared equally around the sphere. That sphere is the explosion radius. If the signature size of the ship you're firing at is the same size or bigger than the explosion radius, the whole sphere is "inside" that ship, meaning that all the damage that's shared across the sphere is applied. Your missile will hit for 100% damage if the target isn't moving! If however the signature size of the ship you're firing at is only 1/4 of the explosion radius, your missile will only hit for 25% damage because the 75% of damage that's shared out over the rest of the explosion radius that's "outside" the target is missing.
So when the ship's not moving, it's pretty straight forwards to work out how much damage you should be doing.
When the ship's moving, it gets a little more complicated. You have to work in explosion velocity too. For this, you have to imagine the sphere is growing at the rate of explosion velocity. When the missile explodes, it does so right on top of the ship you're firing at. Now if the sphere grows too slowly, the ship will be out of it before it manages to do full damage! This is worked out in a similar way as the explosion radius calculation apart from the ship speed wants to be slower than the explosion velocity for more damage. If the ship you're firing at is going the same speed as the explosion velocity and it's sig is the same size or bigger than the explosion radius, you'll hit for 100% damage! If however it's going at twice the speed, then you'll only hit for half damage.
The bigger the missiles you're firing, the bigger the explosion radius and the slower the explosion velocity. That means that smaller ships will have a smaller signature and be travelling faster, which means less of your potential damage is applied.
These two stats stack, so if you're firing a missile that has a 1km explosion radius and the velocity is 10km/s, if the ship that you're firing at has a sig size of 500m and is travelling at 20km/s, you'll only hit it for 25% damage as you lose half damage from the sig size, then half of that total from the speed.
So what can I do to improve my damage against smaller targets?
For guns:
- Shoot things that are further away (but still within your optimal or a good way into your falloff). Things that are further away will have less angular velocity than things closer that are moving the same speed.
- Shoot things that are flying towards or away from you instead of from side to side. Unlike missiles, guns will hit things that are flying directly at you at high speeds.
- Train motion prediction. This is one of those awkward skills that people often skip because it doesn't give any awesome damage numbers. When you think of it in terms of "5% extra tracking can be up to 5% extra damage on ships with high angular" though, it starts to look a lot more appealing.
- Fit tracking computers/enhancers. Computers are better, especially because they can be scripted, but both of these modules give you better tracking for your guns.
- Metastasis rigs will help your guns track better.
- Think about what ammunition you're using. Some give bonuses to tracking, some actually make tracking worse!
- If you're in a small ship with a short range, webs can help you slow ships' angular velocity and help you hit better. If you're in a long range ship, they'll still help but you might just want to throw out drones as unless you have a few webs, tracking can still be quite poor on small ships.
For missiles:
- Shoot things that are moving slower. For pure missile players, angular velocity doesn't matter at all, it's all about the speed.
- Train guided missile precision. Yep, it requires missile launcher operation 5 but it's worth it. It decreases the explosion radius by 5% per level. That means that against smaller ships you can do up to 25% extra damage!
- Train target navigation prediction. This is worded very weirdly, but it's easiest to think of it as it increases the missile explosion velocity by 5% per level (that's not quite how it works technically, but the effect is the same) so it helps to hit fast moving ships.
- Warhead rigor catalysts will help with the signature size of ships.
- Warhead flare catalysts will help with the speed of the target.
- Keep an eye on ship speed. If something suddenly goes from flying 700m/s to 3000m/s, it might be a good idea to shoot it! Yep, it's flying over 3x as fast, but it's probably just activated a MWD which makes it's sig size 5x bigger.
- If you can use T2 ammo, some missiles are better at hitting smaller targets than others.
So that's all great for shooting stuff, but what can you do to reduce the amount of damage you've got incoming?
I'm gonna skip resists here, more resists = less incoming damage, pretty simple.
You basically have to think about the opposite of what the above says. So slow ships with big sigs that are travelling directly at enemies will take a lot of damage.
There's actually very few ways of reducing your sig from the starting point. There are some implants and the prospect gets a bonus for advanced mining frigates to sig size, but in general there's no way to reduce it. What you can do though is be careful about how much you increase it. Certain modules, especially shield modules, will increase your sig size, potentially by quite a lot. Most shield rigs will increase your sig size, shield extenders too. Of course these modules can significantly increase your survivability so you have to weigh up the pros and cons of them. Be wary of modules like inertia stabilisers, they significantly increase your signature size with no bonuses to your tank, especially if you're trying to fit a travel ceptor or something similar, these are more likely to get you killed than save you. Also beware MWDs, usually you want to get into range with them, then turn them off. As I said in the improving missiles section, MWDs massively increase your signature size (by 5x). Once you're in range, you should turn them off again.
Speed is pretty simple, there's lots of mods and rigs that will increase speed. Be careful though as a lot of them will also reduce armour (maybe not an issue if you're shield tanking) or structure. If you're going for a PvE fit, if you have the capacitor to fit an afterburner, that can be a good idea as although it doesn't give you as much speed as a MWD, it also doesn't have the drawbacks.
Angular velocity is something you can practice and do while you're flying around. Remember it doesn't matter against missile ships, but if you're fighting something with guns, always keep an eye on which way you're facing. One thing you can do is try and set up your camera so whatever you have selected is right in the middle of your screen, then double click halfway between the centre and edge of the screen, when done right, that will let you spiral in towards your target so you're always closing range without losing angular velocity until you get close enough to get into an orbit. If you're fighting two ships, be aware of your orbit. If from the point of view of the other ship, you're orbiting from left to right, that means there's times when you're flying directly towards or away from him. Try and get into an orbit that the other ship would see as a circle to maintain angular.
For more detailed articles on weapons mechanics, take a look at these pages:
Turret damage: wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Turret_damage
Missile damage: wiki.eveuniversity.org/Missile_Damage